2,956
edits
Archive:000/Hydrogen gas: Difference between revisions
→How much would be needed, if hydrogen were scaled up?
| Line 125: | Line 125: | ||
}} | }} | ||
{{dp | {{dp | ||
|<nowiki>pgm. | |<nowiki>pgm.status_quo_mining_production</nowiki> | ||
|<nowiki>platinum.mine_production + palladium.mine_production</nowiki> | |<nowiki>platinum.mine_production + palladium.mine_production</nowiki> | ||
|<nowiki>Global production of platinum-group metals (PGMs) from mining (status quo)</nowiki> | |<nowiki>Global production of platinum-group metals (PGMs) from mining (status quo)</nowiki> | ||
| Line 222: | Line 222: | ||
}} | }} | ||
<!-- --- END OF DATA POINTS --- | <!-- --- END OF DATA POINTS --- | ||
--> | --> | ||
'''Scenario 1:''' If hydrogen gas (from wind power) were to directly replace all fossil fuels (this implies that people would drive [[hydrogen combustion vehicles]]): | |||
<tab name="SEE MATHS" collapsed> | |||
<tab name=" | |||
{{calc | {{calc | ||
|electrolysis.pgm_by_power / electrolysis.efficiency / wind.capacity_factor * fossil_fuels.consumption | |electrolysis.pgm_by_power / electrolysis.efficiency / wind.capacity_factor * fossil_fuels.consumption | ||
| Line 239: | Line 234: | ||
{{calc | {{calc | ||
|... | |... | ||
|years pgm. | |years pgm.status_quo_mining_production | ||
|||'''PGMs needed for hydrogen gas production.''' | |||
}} | }} | ||
</tab> | </tab> | ||
The amount of PGMs needed is pretty reasonable (16% of mineral reserves) | * The amount of PGMs needed is pretty reasonable '''(16% of mineral reserves)'''. We'd still have to mine for PGMs a lot faster than the status-quo (and do it ''without'' exploitative [[labor]]). {{npn}} | ||
To prevent NOx emissions ([[#NOx emissions|see section below]]), hydrogen combustion vehicles need ''catalytic converters'', just like gasoline or diesel vehicles do. Catalytic converters ''also'' contain some PGMs, which could be obtained by recycling old catalytic converters from fossil-fuel vehicles. | {{minor|To prevent NOx emissions ([[#NOx emissions|see section below]]), hydrogen combustion vehicles need ''catalytic converters'', just like gasoline or diesel vehicles do. Catalytic converters ''also'' contain some PGMs, which could be obtained by recycling old catalytic converters from fossil-fuel vehicles.}} | ||
'''Scenario 2:''' If all vehicles were hydrogen [[fuel cell vehicles]] instead: | '''Scenario 2:''' If all vehicles were hydrogen [[fuel cell vehicles]] instead: | ||
<tab name=" | |||
<tab name="SEE MATHS" collapsed> | |||
{{calc | {{calc | ||
|(toyota_mirai.pgm - catalytic_converter.pgm) * world.cars * commercial_factor | |(toyota_mirai.pgm - catalytic_converter.pgm) * world.cars * commercial_factor | ||
| Line 257: | Line 254: | ||
{{calc | {{calc | ||
|... | |... | ||
|years pgm. | |years pgm.status_quo_mining_production | ||
|||Fuel-cell vehicles don't | |||'''PGMs needed to make the fuel-cell vehicles.'''{{minor|Fuel-cell vehicles don't have catalytic converters, but a fuel cell contains far more PGMs than a catalytic converter.}} | ||
}} | }} | ||
</tab> | </tab> | ||
| Line 264: | Line 261: | ||
Maybe I should refactor [[template:calc]] to allow for presenting one calculation in multiple units? This would involve some design decisions. | Maybe I should refactor [[template:calc]] to allow for presenting one calculation in multiple units? This would involve some design decisions. | ||
--> | --> | ||
The problem is, fuel cells would need 7 times | * One benefit of fuel cell vehicles is that they're more energy-efficient than combustion vehicles (i.e. less hydrogen used per kilometer driven). | ||
* The problem is, the fuel cells alone would need '''7 times more''' PGMs mined than Scenario 1 (estimated). Perhaps too much to be scalable. And this is true ''even though'' we factored in the recycling of old catalytic converters. | |||
<tab name="General principles" collapsed> | |||
{{minor|The mass of PGMs needed is proportional to ''peak power'':}} | |||
* For electrolysis systems, the maximum '''rate of hydrogen production''' {{light|is limited by the amount of PGMs}}. | |||
* For fuel cell vehicles, the '''horsepower''' {{light|is limited by the amount of PGMs}}. | |||
** {{minor|But the vehicle can still achieve ''short bursts'' of higher horsepower if there's a battery or supercapacitor in parallel with the fuel cell.}} | |||
</tab> | |||
<tab name="More notes on these estimates" collapsed> | <tab name="More notes on these estimates" collapsed> | ||
More musings about the calculations above: | More musings about the calculations above: | ||